this was begun as a result of a past entry here that begins "this is a rant about god". ServusDraconis: The one big gripe that I have with "The Three Religions of the World" is the arrogance of their creators and followers.
battlestarre: i keep thinking of stuff
battlestarre: omg me too
battlestarre: they all say that there's only one god to worship in entirety, but then say that theirs is the only one and tell you your religion is wrong
ServusDraconis: Well, I was mentioning the fact that in Islam, Christianity, and Judaism, the idea that all living things are subserviant to man.
battlestarre: i hate the whole prospect of religion. it's interesting and definatly plays a huge part in our actions and history, but i really do only think it was something we created to feel like we arent alone.
ServusDraconis: But you're right there as well.
battlestarre: yea.
battlestarre: theres a george orwell quote...
ServusDraconis: And Christianity is a breeding ground for irresponsibility.

Auto response from battlestarre: All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others.
George Orwell

battlestarre: it applies to every arguement alive
ServusDraconis: Mainly because there is no idea of cause and effect.
ServusDraconis: There is wrondoing, but no equal and opposite reaction.
ServusDraconis: Just wrongdoing, and then...
battlestarre: yes, agreed.
ServusDraconis: repent!
battlestarre: more wrongdoing, in retaliation
battlestarre: pf...it's just so you feel better about yourself though. if it's truely a sin, there is no repent
ServusDraconis: So you can commit all the sins you want, because Christ died for them, so he's already payed your dues as well as his.
battlestarre: yea, exactly.
ServusDraconis: I like to think that I'm an open minded person, but this is the general trend that I've observed.
ServusDraconis: And the more I read, the more this view prevails.
battlestarre: see, this is what i mean. even my friend, who is hardcore christian...the second person who defends me...agrees that humans have played the idea up so much and it's more worshiping an idea of selfishness than an idea of a presiding being
ServusDraconis: Oh, wow, I'm confused.
ServusDraconis: I need to actually read this posting instead of simply screening it.
battlestarre: the thing that frustrates me the most abotu that persons response is that they were like you're wrong, but im not saying your wrong
battlestarre: and they also said, you need to look more into it...as if i randomly state something i've heard and have not thought about
battlestarre: even worse because i spent so long at a catholic school
ServusDraconis: Yes.
battlestarre: and while it's quite the coincidence that cultures tend to follow the same trends within their very different religions, it doesnt mean it's true.
battlestarre: nearly every culture in the world has pictoral dragons in the history, but that doesnt mean they're real or were ever real.
ServusDraconis: All I can say is that, when asked who the wisest man in all Greece was, the oracle at Delphi simply stated, "Socrates."
ServusDraconis: Yet, when asked Socrates stated, "I am not wise, but at least I know that."
ServusDraconis: Well...
battlestarre: :-). thats why he's wise
ServusDraconis: Dragon theory is a specialty of mine...
ServusDraconis: Exactly.
ServusDraconis: Which is why when asked about my religious beliefs, I always state that I am man, and such things are beyond my understanding.
battlestarre: hm.
battlestarre: i guess i have a very scientific view on things.
ServusDraconis: In what way?
battlestarre: and you know, it's strange because religion is a theory. science is a theory. math is a working theory. history is a story created with theory. life is a theory...and to say you believe so strongly is something so pliable, so subject to change...its so strange.
battlestarre: well, i see humans as being created just the same as anything else...and not by some dirt and gentle hands but by evolution, survival...because the idea is not just reminiscent in our everyday lives, but relentlessly pounding on our backs
ServusDraconis: They are all theories.
battlestarre: i see no creature as more advanced as any other, rather, adapted to it's surroundings.
ServusDraconis: And each theory, being molded of differing points, is tested within its own bounds.
battlestarre: a giraffe is no better than a camel because he is taller
ServusDraconis: However, theorists seem to think that their particular method of testing ought to be applied to all theories.
ServusDraconis: Indeed.
battlestarre: it frustrates me a lot when people talk about how humans are far more intelligent.
ServusDraconis: I know.
ServusDraconis: I've held conversation with animals.
battlestarre: and for the longest while, i simply believed that humans had, in fact, been regressing in their dependence on automation
ServusDraconis: They're very intelligent.
battlestarre: agreed. as've i.
ServusDraconis: I fed a snapping turtle yesterday, and was effectively communicating with him.
battlestarre: but recently i've come upon the fact that all animals have evolved and adapted to what they have. some are just happier with sticking to what they know works for them.
battlestarre: :-)
battlestarre: which is apparent everyday in the human world
ServusDraconis: All animals stick to what they know works for them.
battlestarre: humans have this consistant idea that innovation will progress them, but they still have incessent dependencies on everything that surrounds them.
ServusDraconis: I do believe humans are more beautiful than other animals in that they often pursue wholeheartedly things that, according to the laws of survival, don't work.
ServusDraconis: Yes.
ServusDraconis: It's a tragic beauty that only the best of humans have.
ServusDraconis: Though nature would call it stupidity.
battlestarre: and yet, i find it intimidating and admirable that creatures such as socrates and shakespeare and gandhi and dali and mozart have existed...to create such unnatural but beautiful ideas
battlestarre: (music and art and writing are just as much a philosophy as philosophy itself)
battlestarre: (or as i see it...)
ServusDraconis: Yes.
ServusDraconis: Indeed!
ServusDraconis: There are four areas of the human intellect.
ServusDraconis: History, Art, Science, and Philosophy.
ServusDraconis: History is the actual.
ServusDraconis: Art is the possible.
ServusDraconis: Science is the probable.
ServusDraconis: And Philosophy is the desirable.
battlestarre: and despite how i despise the insistance of progressiveness, i admit i am a part of it and contribute to it. i abhor anyone who simply lives only for themselves. but that is only appropriate for what we have been taught in such a young society.
battlestarre: i often wonder, in fact, believe that animals have similar societies, however, they feel it's unnecessary to actually build durable homes. they're intelligent to see that avoidence of natural disasters is impossible, and they're, in fact, necessary for the ecosystem to thrive.
battlestarre: i get the feeling they're laughing at our insecurities about the ability to live, the fact that we keep our weakest alive.
ServusDraconis: Yes.
battlestarre: and that we would attempt to sabotage ourselves while we live in such a pillowed world.
ServusDraconis: I admit I would do almost anything to avoid death.
ServusDraconis: Define progressiveness.
battlestarre: "life must be nice when you dont have lions chasing you ten miles til you drop from exhaustion." "yea...too bad they forgot what that's like."
battlestarre: that's the thing. is progress what humans have created? or is it keeping the creme of your species alive, creating a stronger, more resilient species?
battlestarre: it's a question i constatly struggle with.
battlestarre: constantly
battlestarre: society commonly defines "civilization" or the building of buildings and creating of interlocking residences and businesses as progress
battlestarre: however, while we are finding more ways to defend ourselves from the "wild", we're also ending up wiht mroe ways to harm ourselves
battlestarre: humans can be defined like the rings placed ceremoniously around a woman's neck in some african tribes. they build until they are hte only support, and if you took them off, the neck, which was once made solely for supporting, can no longer do even that.
ServusDraconis: Philosophy fascinates me.
ServusDraconis: Yet I try to leave it to the philosophers.
battlestarre: i dont even see it as philosophy. it blends in with sociology and psychology and science for me.
battlestarre: and you cant have any of that without history.
ServusDraconis: I'm just trying to help as many people as possible to live rich, meaningful, lives.
battlestarre: that's why i love learning
battlestarre: and art without history doesnt exist, nor history without art
ServusDraconis: I am the same way.
ServusDraconis: Yes.
...
ServusDraconis: Did you know that General Eisenhower didn't go to college, yet he read all kinds of books and educated himself.
ServusDraconis: And his mastery of the battlefield was gleaned from reading things like Thucydides and Caesar.
ServusDraconis: He believed that he was re-incarnated from warriors who fought and died in these battles.
battlestarre: no, but that's interesting. if we didnt need the fuckin' paperwork to get good jobs, i wouldnt go to school either. i'd rather learn faster tahn we do in school
ServusDraconis: Yes.
battlestarre: school is now purely an institution to instill behaviour that is appropiate to society.
ServusDraconis: I agree.
ServusDraconis: It used to exist to create a societal elite, but no longer.
ServusDraconis: Not since "capitalism" and "socialism" took over.
ServusDraconis: Now everyone is the same.
battlestarre: i disagree, to a certain extent.
battlestarre: everyone has the same ability to learn. honestly, i dont believe that the majority of people who have learning disorders really do, it's just they weren't taught to "learn" the same way the other half of the kids were.
battlestarre: i think everyone has the right to learn, despite the fact that it's a strictly vain attempt at progressing.
ServusDraconis: Yes, and by giving "everyone" that right, it drains much of the sustenance of the idea of higher education.
ServusDraconis: Because the masses take advantage of it, and pass the system's requirements without actually becoming more educated individuals.

3 smart personsmart people | any ideas?